Should there be hand sanitizer on MAX?
Posted by Christian in Riding Etiquette on Sep 22nd, 2009 | 26 commentsI haven’t personally bought into the hype that the swine flu* is going to be anything particularly nasty this flu season. That being said, a lot of folks have… and I think that’s actually a good thing because it means individuals are most likely keeping up with covering coughs, washing hands, etc.
KGW recently ran a story about whether or not hand sanitizer helps stop the spread of the H1N1 virus. I was originally thinking, “Well, it’s technically a virus and not a form of bacteria… so hand sanitizer probably wouldn’t be super effective.“ But KGW says it does help!
That got me thinking: the best way to help reduce your chance or perhaps getting the H1N1 virus is staying away from crowded, close-proximity places. Unfortunately, for us public transportation riders, it’s kind of hard to stay away from crowded MAX trains, buses, etc.
So here’s an idea: how about placing some hand sanitizer on MAX trains for folks to use? I know that I personally dread touching, well, anything on the MAX when I ride. And I’m not saying the cleaning folks aren’t doing their job; I’m sure they do an awesome job. But the sheer amount of people that ride, that wipe noses and hold on to the rail, that sneez… ok, you get my point.
What do you all think? If there was perhaps some hand sanitizer on the MAX, maybe by the door, would you perhaps take a couple of pumps and use it? Do you think it would be a good idea to provide folks this? Would you feel perhaps a little bit cleaner if this was provided?
*I’m personally not a fan of media outlets using the term “swine flu” instead of H1N1 virus; the USDA even asked folks to not refer to it as such
Image is from The Heartland Perspective blog
26 Responses to “ “Should there be hand sanitizer on MAX?”
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I ride to work everyday and I would really appreciate hand wipes after touching the hand rails as I leave the bus. I see people cough into their hands almost daily and I always get sick since I started riding the bus. The bus is a vector and with flue season approaching it would be nice. Perhaps some healthcare tax money could fund this. We fund free needle exchange why not.
I think that’s a good idea Christian. It’s a simple way to help stop the spread of germs. It’s amazing how many guys won’t take a minute to wash their hands after using the restroom!
@Kevin – no joke! It’s gross..
I think it’s a great idea.
I recently heard some media person promoting the view that antibacterials aren’t effective against the flu because it’s caused by a virus. Nothing could be further from the truth.
In general, viruses are even more fragile in the external environment than bacteria are. Antibacterial hand cleaners, wipes, etc. that are effective against bacteria are also very effective against viruses.
I think the confusion comes about because antibiotics–which attack bacteria inside the human body–aren’t effective against viral infections. Viruses and bacteria behave very differently when they are inside of people infecting them but in the outside environment they are both vulnerable to bleach, alcohol and other sanitzing agents that you can’t use inside a human.
I’m not going to wait for TriMet, however, as they have to worry about vandalism, resupply, etc. to do something on the busses and trains.
I’m not a big germophobe and don’t usually carry hand sanitizer but now that flu season is coming on I will carry a bottle and use it after I get off the MAX or bus.
@Doretta – thanks for that explanation!
It’s not Trimet’s responsibility to provide sanitizer, especially considering their shortfall in budget. People should bring their own hand sanitizer/ wipes and get vaccinated if they’re paranoid about it. I read just yesterday that there should be plenty of H1N1 vaccine available beginning in October – see the last paragraph: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/21/AR2009092101505.html
No, it’s not Tri-Met’s “responsibility” but it sure would be nice. They don’t do a lot of things one could consider their “responsibility” like provide adequate fare and smoking enforcement.
No. If you ride transit as much as some people around here, you probably already make an effort to wash your hands after arriving at your destination or carry around hand sanitizer in your pocket, purse or backpack.
Instead of supplying vehicles with a personal sanitizer (one can purchase bottles for less than the price of an all-day ticket), why not use this idea to promote public health practices? Cover your cough (cough into your sleeve), wash your hands regularly, or if you can, stay home when you’re sick.
I think using hand sanitizer is a great idea, but don’t look for it being supplied by TriMet since our budget is very tight, like somebody already pointed out. A small bottle is only around $ 3, so it should be something anybody could get.
Our budget shortfall has caused even a favorite of ours, the Rail Rodeo, to be canceled this year. It is where rail operators have a chance to show off their skills – and a place where friends and family of TriMet employees are allowed to try to operate a MAX train under VERY controlled circumstances on a short track in the yard. Maybe next year…
If you ever see me operate the train, you will see me with brown gloves on my hands; many reasons why I and a few other operators use these gloves, but one is definitely germs of any kind anywhere on the trains, the cabs included…
I am glad I am not a bus driver right now; I will be happy in my little cab until this flu season is over.
Why isn’t Tri-Met taking every opportunity to enforce fares and the smoking ban since the budget is so tight? Why give thousands of teenagers free rides on the system when the budget is so tight? Why have only 15-30 (it depends on who you talk to) fare inspectors for the ENTIRE system?
Kevin, thousands of teenagers are NOT riding our system for free. I would like to know where you have come up with that very generalized number.
Fare inspections have increased dramatically by all the following personnel: both our rail and bus supervisors are doing fare inspections – on the MAX. So are transit police officer and regular police officers – oh, I forgot: the SHERIFF offices in both Multnomah and Washington counties ALSO check fares and keep an eye on things. (I bet you did not know that a big part of bus supervisors’ job is to check fares on MAX, did you?)
What more do you want? A total police state???
Your complaints are based on pure guessing on your part, and – I must ask – perhaps a dislike of our system?
I am just tired of people talking and writing about TriMet issues that they have little firsthand knowledge about.
So there!
Now I will get off my soap box – and back to thinking about the next post on my own blog… sigh…
Eva, I may be mistaken but I think Kevin is referring to the Portland Public Schools High School Student Pass ( http://trimet.org/fares/youthstudent.htm , http://www.pps.k12.or.us/news/1028.htm ).
Interesting thread drift, though: do fare inspectors regularly carry hand sanitizer?
I think y’all are missing an important line there at the bottom: The Student Pass program is a partnership between the school district and the City of Portland, and is funded through a State of Oregon Business Energy Tax Credit and Portland Public Schools. It is not subsidized by TriMet.
Trimet didn’t shell out for the student passes. They are paid for.
Rrider and Marissa,
Thank you for pointing this out; I knew that Kevin’s suggestion that students were somehow riding for free, at TriMet’s cost, due to lack of fare inspections, must have been wrong.
I think this is a great idea; it makes it safer for students go get to school, and a lot easier for parents who are often at work by the time their kids must leave for school, and when the kids come home from school.
Bravo for whoever came up with this great idea, and for the groups who are subsidizing this! This is what PUBLIC TRANSIT is all about.
Thanks for pointing out that we, as taxpayers, aren’t footing the high school student program bill, Rrider. It’s definitely a good point to keep in mind.
Rrider – the last fare inspectors I saw on the MAX did not carry hand sanitizers. But maybe it was in one of their 100s of little pouches they have on their belts..
Those cute little hand-sanitizer globes have little motors in them. They are refilled with plastic balloon-type containers. Trimet’s expense would not be just for the actual goo, but for the purchase, installation, maintenance, and refilling of the little machines. I wonder how many times a day they would need refilling. Cruise ships can add the cost of these things into their ticket prices; plus they have the CDC on their backs to contain Norwalk virus.
We need to take responsibility for our own health. Wash your hands after being outside & on transit; try to train yourself not to touch your face (keep a tissue for scratching your nose); cough into your elbow or into a tissue; etc.
When the train comes in at night send the cleaning crew through with that sanitizing chemical that veterinarians use to clean their kennels. Much cheaper. Might even help to remove some unpleasant body odors that linger after the passenger leaves.
Marissa,
Somehow you’re missing the point that someone is paying for those teenagers to ride the system and it isn’t themselves. It’s the taxpayers who in addition pay their own fares on Tri-Met. That was my point.
Each time I have written and talked with a representative at Tri-Met they have told me that Tri_met has between 15 and 30 fare inspectors. That isn’t a number pulled out of the sky like you make it to seem.
Furthermore you don’t address the problems of cigarette smokers clearly smoking in areas where “no smoking” signs are posted. Evidently like Tri-Met you choose to ignore the issue.
Kevin, I know that you addressed your comment above to Marissa, but I feel I need to comment again.
Please go to the post a little above this one where I explain in detail what TriMet is doing as far as fare inspectors/rail supervisors/bus supervisors – all of whom are FARE INSPECTORS now, in addition to various law enforcement officers.
TriMet is doing a LOT to crack down on those who do not pay fares – I know, since I happen to work for this company. I have a good idea of what is going on.
As far as the teenagers getting a “free ride” on public transit: what is the problem with how that is paid for? As Christian referring to Rriders post above, thanking her for providing links that shows that the public is NOT paying for this. To me, you seem like an *anti public transit* guy who loves to find fault with TriMet at every opportunity.
As a side note: hand sanitizers probably would not be practical to have on trains, although it would be nice. The trains are thoroughly washed and sanitized – how it is done, I do not know in great detail, but if you pass by Elmonica on the trains late at night, you see the cleaning crews out in all kinds of weather cleaning the trains; the buses are cleaned and sanitized as well, at each garage at night.
If anybody is concerned about bacteria at TriMet, how about the stores you go to? How about the shopping carts? How about the door handles you touch EVEN IN YOUR OWN HOME? Are they sanitized every day? We live in a world full of bacteria, and some of us decide to protect ourselves in different ways.
Recently when I was out and about, I simply used the hand sanitizer I have sitting in my car (also bring one with me to work) and washed my hands every time I got into my car. With the nasty flu season upon us (swine flu, anyone?), they tell us NOT to put our fingers in our faces without first washing them, or sanitizing them.
Happy weekend!
Good grief… My head is no thinking clearly – Christian, I nee dto be able o edit mys posts… Ugh…
Kevin,
Sure, the money comes from somewhere to pay for these kids to ride, but I support it and I’m glad my tax money is going toward getting kids to school everyday. The real problem is that PPS only provides (very) limited bus service and if they provided GOOD school bus service, guess what, that would be coming out our pockets too. At least someone is stepping up to help out our youth. I am a parent of a public school child and I have to take a 2 hour lunch to get him from half-day school to a daycare so I can go back to work. PPS school bus service would be a huge help to me.
I never said anything about fare inspectors, maybe you’re thinking of MAX operator Eva who, in my opinion, is an asset to the company and to our community. She has writes an informative blog about some of the inner workings of Trimet and she draws from first-hand knowledge of the system. As for my experience with Fare inspectors, I’ve been riding MAX for about 5 years and have had my fare checked maybe 10 times. I think they could do much better in this aspect, but ridership is down and so is general employment so they really just do not have the man power to do an effective job here. Of course, I’m always asked to show valid fare when boarding a bus outside of Fareless Square. In fact, on the evening of 9/30 I showed my October pass and the driver asked to see my September pass, which I still had on-hand. I had changed it out a five hours too early, apparently.
And certainly smoking on MAX platforms and at bus stop bothers me a lot, but you can’t have everything. Trimet dumped TONS of money into our new Transit Mall and I appreciate that since I depend on Trimet for 99% of my travel. I too wish I saw more citations for these offenders, but I know we don’t live in a perfect world so I don’t expect it to be one.
I don’t choose to ignore issues, I simply choose my battles.
Eva,
Do you understand that the money for the fares for teeenagers doesn’t appear out of thin air? It has to come from somewhere and that is the pockets of the taxpayers. Government gets it’s income from taxes and from borrowing money.
The security officers that you mentioned are not permitted to write tickets. They really serve no purpose except to break up fights on MAX platforms between unruly teenagers.
If you do not believe me that there are only 15-30 fare inspectors you can contact Naomia Johnson-Dubose @ Tri-Met and find out for yourself. Her telephone number is 503-962-2444. The ONLY people who can write tickets are the fare inspectors and local police. Wackenhut people can’t do a thing.
I’ve traveled quite a bit and been on many a transit system. Portland is easily the most lax when it comes to enforcing the rules. Just this past week I was in Washington, DC riding the subway. Not A SINGLE PERSON put their feet up on the seats or smoked on the platforms. Until Tri-Met actually starts taking enforcement of fares and the smoking ban seriously it’s pointless for them to whine about money being tight. They are bleeding money right and left from lack of enforcement.
Kevin
Kevin,
You show your ignorance, and I do not know who you get your information from, but you must have misunderstood the information you have been given by a TriMet representative who surely knows how this system is now set up.
We only have a small handful of men and women who are ONLY doing FARE INSPECTIONS. However, ALL supervisors, both bus and rail supervisors (we have about 33 at rail alone – not sure how many at bus, but there must be more at bus since there is a much greater area to cover) are now WRITING FARE EVASION TICKETS – their jobs were changed about a year ago, to include being FARE INSPECTORS as well as supervisors. I see it all the time – I KNOW what I am talking about. I know these people. I read the memo!
In addition, both police officers and sheriff’s deputies are ALSO writing FARE EVASION TICKETS. I also see this all the time.
The security officers you are talking about, work with TriMet as private SECURITY, and they do NOT write tickets for fare evasions, so you ARE right about that.
It seems to me you are not reading what I am writing, but only what you want to see – and believe.
In regard to the teenagers getting “fee” passes for TriMet, that has been discussed sufficiently on here that if you WANTED TO, you could actually learn how that is being taken care of. Of course somebody has to pay – and it seems that the people in charge of this excellent program have the support from some good sources.
I am not going to discuss these two topics any more with you – I do not think Christian wants his excellent web site made into a fight between two posters.
Christian, kudos to you for letting us go on like this; I am now done with this topic.
Kevin, whatever else you might write here, I am giving up – we live in a society where anybody may believe anything they want – thank goodness that we still have that freedom!
Oppss… that should be: “In regard to the teenagers getting FREE passes…”
I totally agree that there should be hand sanitizer on the buses and tri met light rails. Last week, I was on the train on a blue line train, and was thinking about how hand sanitizer was needed with all of the passengers on board.